Wigtownshire Ramblers Talnotry June 2014

Saturday the 28th of June 2014

Saturday's walk was a strenuous A walk to Billy Marshall's cave and beyond. Because of this, A O'K recce'd a low level alternative for walkers wanting an easier day.

The leaders of the hill climb were the Milkmaid and Lionheart.

The 'Milkmaid' and A O'K will be writing the walk report and that will follow the images.

I'll begin the post with 

THE LOW LEVEL WALK

Because I was still aching from the Rig of the Jarkness on Thursday, I opted for the easier walk.

It's a variation of a walk we did back in October 2011.

October 2011 Walk

Eleven of us set off from the Talnotry Car Park, climbing up to the path running south west.

This was probably the hardest part of the walk.

Talnotry Hill Viewpoint

Here's a landscape picture from Miss Goodnight, shame this blog author got in the way !

We had a bit of a scramble down to the Loch of the Lowes. 

I didn't get any decent pictures here, so here's a collage from a previous visit when I saw the goldeneye ducks. 

Remember this video ?. Beethoven - GoldenEye Ducks - Duckin' and Divin'

A change of direction took us north east along the forest road.

Once the main road out of Newton Stewart it's still called the Old Edinburgh Road. 

Another fine picture from Miss Goodnight.

When we came to this :- Shaft(dis) as marked on the OS map, I thought I had the answer.

In 2008 and 2011, I mentioned it as being a lead or copper mine, then on my blog posts thinking I'd corrected myself by calling it the Talnotry Nickel Mine.

Now after looking at grid references and aditnow.co.uk I've come to the conclusion  I know nothing about this shaft. The Talnotry Nickel Mine is located nearer the Glen of the Bar and aditnow have nothing about this particular shaft.

I've narrowed the grid ref to NX 488 724, or one digit either way. I can find no reference to this particular location anywhere on the internet. Perhaps some geological genius will finally put me right.

Three of us took a short diversion to look at this cracking waterfall and pool on the Grey Mares Tail burn.

Wild swimming here I come !
Back on the forest road we found an ideal pile of stones for a lunch break.

After lunch we continued along to the Black Loch.

I stitched two pictures together to get the whole of 'The Eye' in.

"Standing around 8 metres high this perfect spire is made from red-earthen tiles, showing their rough broken edge on the outside. Once you are standing beside it you should soon realise why it’s creator Colin Rose has called it the ‘Eye’!"

Dumfries and Galloway Natural History

As this dead mole was discovered one walker recollected the texture of a certain moleskin jacket.

On reaching the Tonderghie burn, we rounded the loch and retraced our steps along the forest road. 

Back at the Grey Mares Tail burn we turned south.

Here we came to the Matt Baker sculptures. A few years older than I thought, they go back to 1997.

Although the 'Quorum' stays in place, it appears one of the lone sculptures has been stolen.

It's possibly the reason for new concrete 'filling in' shown here.

Grey Mare's Tail path.

Grey Mares Tail gorge, scene of a fatal 'Gorge Jumping' pursuit.

BBC News

Perhaps a more permanent memorial could be erected ?

A climb down.................

.............then up again.

There's a well worn path up here.

Built in 1835 the listed obelisk Murray's Monument is a very popular short climb.

Being located right beside the A712, the Newton Stewart to New Galloway road with a handy car park right below makes it attractive to passers by.

  

Our weary climbers take a moment.

The path round the back of the monument takes us back to the cars.
Our group then returned to Newton Stewart to enjoy excellent refreshments at the Belted Galloway.

Now here's a few pictures from Shorty and one from the Milkmaid of the 

HIGH LEVEL WALK

Update 7th of July :- I received some pictures today from the 'Croupier' taken by her husband during this climb. Here's a selection.

 Looking back to Murray's Monument.

 Inside Billy Marshall's cave.

 Is that a troglodyte ?

 Wreckage and Shorty

Millfore Summit

Thanks for dealing me those good lady, it's my pleasure to include them.


Doesn't time fly, It's almost five years since we last climbed to Billy Marshall's Cave.
2009 Walk 
I believe all of these pictures were taken after the visit to the cave.
(It's also quite possible I have some out of sequence, if so I hope it doesn't bother anyone, 'cause it doesn't me)

 After lunch in Louran Glen

 Wreckage of the USAF McDonald Douglas Phantom which crashed into Cairnsmore on the 28th of March 1979.

Fence leading up to the Nick of the Saddle.

It looks tough.

Which way now ?

Minnigaff Hills View.

Last braes before the Nick of the Saddle.

 Nick of the Saddle

 Meikle Mulltaggart

 A cool wind blows across the lesser known Millfore summit.

Millfore Hill.

Here's the reports.

Wigtownshire Ramblers 28th June 2014

On Saturday Wigtownshire Ramblers had a choice of two walks, a high level walk with a diversion to Billy Marshall’s cave and a low level walk around Talnotry.
17 ramblers choosing the high level walk set off from Talnotry, crossing the Palnure burn and following the forest road upwards until the Louran burn was reached. A short push through well grown bracken led to a grassy walk along a picturesque stream with large flat rocks and small waterfalls. The lack of recent rain made the Louran burn easy to cross.
The group then traversed the moorland towards the slopes of Cairnsmore of Fleet, where wild goats were spotted camouflaged against the rocks. Leaving rucksacks against a large boulder a detour took walkers to Billy Marshall’s cave which they then explored with torches. In the 1700s this cave was used as a hide out for a gang, whose leader was Billy Marshall, and as a store for the proceeds of their activities which probably included smuggling. Reputedly Billy Marshall lived to be 120, married 17 times and had scores of children. He is buried in St Cuthbert’s churchyard in Kirkcudbright.
Re-donning rucksacks the party followed the fence line leading up to the Nick of the Saddle. Part of the USAF McDonald Douglas Phantom light aircraft, which crashed into Cairnsmore of Fleet on 28th March 1979, lay across the route.  A rocky area close to this was chosen for lunch.
Refreshed, the walkers continued through rough heather up to the Nick of the saddle where they were able to enjoy panoramic views. This included the Lake District hills and Northern Ireland. In contrast the path to Meikle Mulltaggart was easy underfoot, then following a bike track past peat hags on a flat plateau, the rocky slopes of Craignelder were reached. This was a quick climb and the cairn of Millfore Hill was a stroll from here. The visibility was so good that the dome on Lowther Hill could be seen.
Descending, a quad bike track led to a forest ride which led to a forest road and eventually cars waiting at the Red Deer Range car park where drivers could be ferried to Talnotry for their cars.

Meanwhile a second group, who were looking for an easier day, set off on a circular walk which led past the Loch of the Lowes and along the Old Edinburgh Road. The entrance to an old mine was investigated followed by a diversion to see the waterfall on The Grey Mares Tail burn which was disappointing as it was as low as any of the party could remember seeing before. Shortly afterwards lunch was taken beside the bridge over the burn. They then followed the road to the Black Loch stopping to admire the Eye, a sculpture standing around 8 metres high. It is a perfect spire representing a needle with an “eye” through its centre.  After circling the Black Loch the group walked past the Quorum, a group of heads carved from local stone and set into the walls of a sheep enclosure. The ramblers then walked up and over a hill and down towards the car park at Murray’s Monument. The climb to the top of the monument was rewarded by views across the valley and the party were able to trace the route taken by the other group along the forest road and up to Billy Marshall’s cave. They were not in view however, having long since completed that part of their walk. The group wandered back down the path to the cars at Talnotry car park. Unlike the first group they were back in time for tea and cakes at The Belted Galloway in Newton Stewart.

Next week on Saturday July 5th there is an 8 mile linear walk from Isle of Whithorn to Garlieston. Meet for car sharing at the Riverside, Newton Stewart at 8.30am, Stranraer Breastworks at 8.15am, or Garlieston (NX 478 462) at 9.30 where the bus will be caught to the start of the walk (remember bus passes if you have one). No dogs allowed on this walk. New members are always welcome but must contact the walk leader on 01988 840268.

Billy Marshall-Tinker or Tinkler

In previous blogs i've made reference to one Billy Marshall-King of the Gypsies,Tinkers or Tinklers.
I was wandering through Kirkcudbright graveyard a few weeks ago,and came upon this memorial.
The inscription reads 'The Remains of William Marshall,Tinker who died 28th Novr 1792 at the advanced age of 120 years'

Note the coins on top of the stone.The original idea of leaving coins goes back to 'Paying the Ferryman' to allow the soul passage to the other side,but maybe the tinkers have another tradition.
I'm not superstitious,but I added to the tally and made a wish.

This is what Wikipedia says:

Billy Marshall (1672-1792) was born in Ayrshire in 1672 of Romany stock and claimed to be King of the Gypsies in south-east Scotland for most of the 1700s. He was a boxer, and served in the services, allegedly deserting from the Army seven times and from the Navy three times. He was supposed to have married 17 times and he had a huge crowd of illegitimate children (four of whom he is said to have fathered after his 100th birthday). He is also said to have been involved in murder and robbery, running a gang of gypsy tinkers in Galloway. He was the so-called 'King of the Randies', and having served as a soldier he was able to organise the country people who lost land when landowners built stone dykes and walls - his men went round knocking them down. Was a smuggler in Kirkcudbright. He was also reputed to be a gypsy and robber, and Caird (gypsy) of Burullion, the area he controlled.

Here's another account from the early 1800's

This item was a letter to the editor of Blackwood's Edinburgh Magazine April - September 1817.

SOME ACCOUNT OF BILLY MARSHAL, A GYPSEY CHIEF.

AMONG some instructive and many very entertaining articles in your Magazine, I have been a good deal amused in reading your account of the gypsies, and more particularly of the gypsies of our own country. The race has certainly degenerated (if I may be allowed to use the expression), and is in some risk of becoming extinct, whether to the advantage of society or not I will leave to the profound to determine. In the mean time, I am very well pleased that you have united with the anonymous author of Guy Mannering, in recording the existence, the manners, and the customs, of this wonderful people.

But, I have been, I assure you, in no small degree disappointed, when reading the names of the Faas, the Baileys, the Gordons, the Shaws, the Browns, the Keiths, the Kennedys, the Ruthvens, the Youngs, the Taits, the Douglasses, the Blythes, the Allans, and the Montgomeries, &c. — to observe so noted a family as the Marshals altogether omitted. I beg leave to add, that your author will be considered either a very ignorant, or a very partial historian, by all the readers and critics in the extensive districts of Galloway and Ayrshire, if he persists in passing over in silence the distinguished family of Billy Marshal, and its numerous cadets. I cannot say that I, as an individual, owe any obligations to the late Billy Marshal; but, sir, I am one of an old family in the Stewartry of Galloway, with whom Billy was intimate for nearly a whole century. He visited regularly, twice a year, my great-grandfather, grandfather, and father, and partook, I dare say, of their hospitality; but he made a grateful and ample return ; for during all the days of Billy's natural life, which the sequel will shew not to have been few, the washings could have been safely left out all night, without any thing, from a sheet or a tablecloth down to a dishclout, being in any danger. During that long period of time, there never was a goose, turkey, duck, or hen, taken away, but what could have been clearly traced to the fox, the brock, or the fumart; and I have heard an old female domestic of ours declare, that she had known Billy Marshal and his gang, again and again, mend all the "kettles, pans, and crackit pigs, in the house, and mak twa or three dozen o' horn spoons into the bargain, and never tak a farthing o' the laird's siller."

I am sorry that I cannot give you any very minute history of my hero: however, I think it a duty I owe on account of my family, not to allow, as far as I can hinder it, the memory, and name, of so old a friend and benefactor to fall into oblivion, when such people as the Faas and Baileys, &c. are spoken of.

Where he was born I cannot tell. Who were his descendants I cannot tell; I am sure he could not do it himself, if he were living. It is known that they were prodigiously numerous; I dare say, numberless. For a great part of his long life, he reigned with sovereign sway over a numerous and powerful gang of gypsey tinkers, who took their range over Carrick in Ayrshire, the Carrick mountains, and over the Stewartry and Shire of Galloway ; and now and then, by way of improving themselves, and seeing more of the world, they crossed at Donaghadee, and visited the counties of Down and Derry. I am not very sure about giving you up Meg Merrilies quite so easily; I have reason to think, she was a Marshal, and not a Gordon: and we folks in Galloway think this attempt of the Borderers, to rob us of Meg Merrilies, no proof that they have become quite so religious and pions, as your author would have us to believe, but rather that, with their religion and piety, they still retain some of their ancient habits. We think this attempt to deprive us of Meg Merrilies almost as bad as that of the descendants of the barbarous Picts, now inhabiting the banks of the Dee in Aberdeenshire, who some years ago attempted to run off with the beautiful lyric of Mary's Dream; and which we were under the necessity of proving, in one of the courts of Apollo, to be the effusion of Low's muse, on the classic and romantic spot, situated at the conflux of the Dee and the Ken, in the Stewartry of Galloway. But to return from this digression to Billy Marshal: - I will tell you everything more about him I know ; hoping this may catch the eye of someone who knew him better, and who will tell you more.

Billy Marshal's account of himself was this: he was born in or about the year 1666; but he might have been mistaken as to the exact year of his birth; however, the fact never was doubted, of his having been a private soldier in the army of King William, at the battle of the Boyne. It was also well known, that he was a private in some of the British regiments, which served under the great Duke of Marlborough in Germany, about the year 1705. But at this period, Billy's military career in the service of his country ended. About this time he went to his commanding officer, one of the McGuffogs of Ruscoe, a very old family in Galloway, and asked him if he had any commands for his native country: being asked if there was any opportunity, he replied, yes; he was going to Keltonhill fair, having for some years made it a rule never to be absent. His officer knowing his man, thought it needless to take any very strong measure to hinder him; and Billy was at Keltonhill accordingly.

Now Billy's destinies placed him in a high sphere; it was about this period, that, either electively, or by usurpation, he was placed at the head of that mighty people in the south west, whom he governed with equal prudence and talent for the long space of eighty or ninety years. Some of his admirers assert, that he was of royal ancestry, and that he succeeded by the laws of hereditary succession ; but no regular annals of Billy's house were kept, and oral tradition and testimony weigh heavily against this assertion. From any research I have been able to make, I am strongly disposed to think, that, in this crisis of his life, Billy Marshal had been no better than Julius Caesar, Richard III., Oliver Cromwell, Hyder Ally, or Napoleon Bonaparte: I do not mean to say, that he waded through as much blood as some of those, to seat himself on a throne, or to grasp at the diadem and sceptre; but it was shrewdly suspected, that Billy Marshal had stained his character and his hands with human blood. His predecessor died very suddenly, it never was supposed by his own hand, and he was buried as privately about the foot of Cairnsmuir, Craig Nelder, or the Corse of Slakes, without the ceremony, or, perhaps more properly speaking, the benefit of a precognition being taken, or an inquest held by a coroner's jury. During this long reign, he and his followers were not outdone in their exploits, by any of the colonies of Kirk-Yetholm, Horncliff, Spital, or Lochmaben. The following anecdote will convey a pretty correct notion, of what kind of personage Billy was, in the evening of his life; as for his early days, I really know nothing more of them than what I have already told.

The writer of this, in the month of May 1789, hail returned to Galloway after a long absence: he soon learned that Billy Marshal, of whom he had heard so many tales in his childhood, was still in existence. Upon one occasion he went to Newton-Stewart, with the late Mr M'Culloch of Barholm and the late Mr Hannay of Bargaly, to dine with Mr Samuel M'Caul. Billy Marshal then lived at the hamlet or clachan of Polnure, a spot beautifully situated on the burn or stream of that name; we called on our old hero, - he was at home, — he never denied himself, — and soon appeared; — he walked slowly, but firmly towards the carriage, and asked Mr Hannay, who was a warm friend of his, how he was? — Mr Hannay asked if he knew who was in the carriage? he answered, that his eyes " had failed him a gude dale;" but, added, that he saw his friend Barholm, and that he could see a youth sitting betwixt them, whom he did not know. I was introduced, and had a gracious shake of his hand. He told me I was setting out in life, and admonished me to "tak care o my han’, and do naething to dishonor the gude stock o’ folk that I was come o';" he added, that I was the fourth generation of us he had been acquaint wi’. Each of us paid a small pecuniary tribute of respect, — I attempted to add to mine, but Barholm told me, he had fully as much as would be put to a good use.

We were returning the same way, betwixt ten and eleven at night, after spending a pleasant day, and taking a cheerful glass with our friend Mr M'Caul; we were descending the beautifully wooded hills, above the picturesque glen of Polnure, — my two companions were napping, — the moon shone clear, — and all nature was quiet, excepting Polnure burn, and the dwelling of Billy Marshal, — the postilion stopt (in these parts the well-known, and well-liked Johnny Whurk), and turning round with a voice which indicated terror he said, "Gude guide us, there's folk singing psalms in the wud.'" My companions awoke and listened, — Barholm said, "psalms, sure enough;” but Bargaly said, " the deil a-bit o' them are psalms." We went on, and stopt again at the door of the old king: we then heard Billy go through a great many stanzas of a song, in such a way that convinced us that his memory and voice, had, at any rate, not failed him; he was joined by a numerous and powerful chorus. It is quite needless to be so minute as to give any account of the song which Billy sung; it will be enough to say that my friend Barholm was completely wrong, in supposing it to be a psalm; it resembled in no particular, psalm, paraphrase, or hymn. We called him out again, — he appeared much brisker than he was in the morning: we advised him to go to bed; but he replied, that "he didna think he wad be muckle in his bed that night, — they had to tak the country in the morning (meaning, that they were to begin a ramble over the country), and that they "were just takin a wee drap drink to the health of our honours, wi' the lock siller we had gi'en them." I shook hands with him for the last time, — he then called himself above one hundred and twenty years of age: he died about 1790.

His great age never was disputed to the extent of more than three or four years. The oldest people in the country allowed the account to be correct - The great-grandmother of the writer of this article died at the advanced age of one hundred and four; her age was correctly known. She said, that Wull Marshal was a man when she was a bitt callant, (provincially, in Galloway, a very young girl.) She had no doubt as to his being fifteen or sixteen years older than herself, and he survived her several years. His long reign, if not glorious, was in the main fortunate for himself and his people. Only one great calamity befel him and them, during that long space of time in which he held the reins of government. It may have been already suspected, that with Billy Marshal ambition was a ruling passion; and this bane of human fortune had stimulated in him a desire to extend his dominions from the Brigg end of Dumfries to the Newton of Ayr, at a time when he well knew the braes of Glen-Nap, and the Water of Doon, to be his western precinct. He reached the Newton of Ayr, which I believe is in Kyle; but there he was opposed, and compelled to re-cross the river, by a powerful body of tinkers from Argyle or Dumbarton. He said, in his bulletins, that they were supported by strong bodies of Irish sailors, and Kyle colliers. Billy had no artillery, but his cavalry and infantry suffered very severely. He was obliged to leave a great part of his baggage provisions, and camp equipage, behind him ; consisting of kettles, pots, pans, blankets, crockery, horns, pigs, poultry, &c. A large proportion of shelties, asses, and mules, were driven into the water and drowned, which occasioned a heavy loss, in creels, panniers, hampers, tinkers' tools, and cooking utensils; and although he was as well appointed, as to a medical staff, as such expeditions usually were, in addition to those who were missing, many died of their wounds. However, on reaching Maybole with his broken and dispirited troops, he was joined by a faithful ally from the county of Down; who, unlike other allies on such occasions, did not forsake him in his adversity. This junction enabled our hero to rally, and pursue in his turn: a pitched battle was again fought, somewhere about the Brigg of Doon or Alloway Kirk; when both sides, as is usual, claimed a victory; but, however this may have been, it is believed that this disaster, which happened A. D. 1712, had slaked the thirst of Billy's ambition: He was many years in recovering from the effects of this great political error; indeed, it had nearly proved as fatal to the fortunes of Billy Marshal, as the ever memorable Russian campaign did to Napoleon Bonaparte, about the same year in the succeeding century.

It is usual for writers, to give the character along with the death of their prince or hero: I would like to be excused from the performance of any such task, as drawing the character of Billy Marshall; but it may be done in a few words, by saying, that he had from nature a strong mind, with a vigorous and active person; and that, either naturally or by acquirement, he possessed every mental and personal quality, which was requisite for one who was placed in his high station, and who held sovereign power over his fellow-creatures for so great a length of time: I would be glad if I could, with impartiality, close my account here; but it becomes my duty to add, that, (from expediency, it is believed, not from choice) with the exception of intemperate drinking, treachery and ingratitude, he practised every crime which is incident to human nature,—those of the deepest dye, I am afraid, cannot with truth be included in the exception: In short, his people met with an irreparable loss in the death of their king and leader; but it never was alleged, that the moral world sustained any loss by the death of the man.
Edinburgh, May 26, 1817.

Wigtownshire Ramblers-Billy Marshalls Cave Circular

I'm the deputy walk leader for todays walk.We did the recce for this walk on Wednesday the 8th of July,so i'm including some pictures and references from the recce.

It's Saturday the 11th of July,and todays walk is a nine and a half mile circular from Talnotry to Billy Marshalls Cave.
I climbed up here via the Louran Burn back in April 2008.My blog of that day is here
Billy Marshalls Cave

Todays walk is classed as moderate to strenuous,and we're a group of eleven intrepid walkers.

Heading south on forest track and crossing the Palnure Burn our first point of interest is the granite slab known to many a mountain biker as McMoab.Tyre marks can still be seen on the face,and on our return there are fresh tracks.
We're keeping Craignelder to our left as we continue upwards.Sticking to the forest roads means a fair amount of zig zagging.

A static Forestry Commission multi purpose vehicle takes our interest.Looks like the birds have flown the nest.

As we reach the end of what seemed an endless forest track we take a mini break before the next stage.Interest in my recent islands trip allows me to relate some it's highlights.


Inset is the 'Noble Fir'.
Now at approximately 300 Metres or 1000Ft,we head through a fairly heavy going swampy forest ride...

...and emerge at the Louran Burn almost directly opposite the rocky slopes that contain the cave.

On the recce,i indicated that this might be where the cave was situated.The problem was,that even through binoculars we couldn't see the upright metal bar that identifies it.Luckily we didn't spend too much time looking elsewhere before realising that the original group of rocks was the correct one.

Now at the cave,our walk leader has brought along a torch.My original assumption was that the cave was only about 8ft by 8ft.Now i know different.At the entrance cave is a ledge into the larger cavern which looks as though it goes back about 30ft.It is very cramped and tapering.Perhaps it's caved in some since Billy Marshalls day.You could certainly hide a fair amount of contraband in here.

The weather forecast is for it to cloud over and rain later,but it's staying bright for us as we lunch.Our walk leader imparts some knowledge he's gleaned of the activities of the infamous Billy Marshall.

I took a couple of tumbles here on the recce,as did a couple of todays walkers.It's quite a slope and the heather manages to hide a few holes and dips.Time to begin our descent.

This is Bo.On the recce Bo must have done a twenty mile walk,while untiringly waiting for a stick to be thrown.Stamina was never a question for this lady.

Also seen on the recce were some mountain goats keeping their eyes on our activities,and a plane marked 'Army' overhead.


We're now heading westwards on these lower slopes of Cairnsmore..

...where we find one of the original paths,underlaid with stone and edged with boulders.Apparently built to allow an infirm Duke of Bedford ascend Cairnsmore by horse.
There's a downloadable Pdf with lots of info on Cairnsmore at
Cairnsmore Pdf

A fairly long stretch of boggy path and forest road via Blairbuies hill now brings us to a point...

...overlooking Dallash and Corwar.Time for a photoshoot.

Here i was asked the question whether it was easier walking now since Scoop One wanted to take her gaiters off.
Now a few folks who know me,know that i sometimes make utterances before my brain has assimilated the information i want to impart.
'Splodgy',the first word was ok,but the second word was to be either 'Bits' or 'Ditches'.Much mirth and merriment followed when the sentence 'There's still quite a few Splodgy Bitches ahead' came out of my mouth.I'll never live that down.

Now we're down near Corwar in a field next to the Louran Burn.We have a good break here as a few walkers divest themselves of protective clothing and get more comfortable.Refreshments are taken by those with some left.
We head over the Louran while a Belted Galloway bull lazily eyes us going past.

Now at Corwar...

...where the horses seem very friendly...

...as do the occupants.

This is one of a couple of youngsters in a seperate field alongside their mothers.

Now we cross ...

...and recross,the Palnure Burn as we head along the final forest tracks.

Murray's Monument coming into view is a welcome sight for the wearier of the walkers...

...but Bo could do it all again.Now!
Another very enjoyable walk with the nicest folk around.
Looking forward to the barbecue next week.